Trouble creating Double Wing Slice Cake – RA143035

[Barehm]

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I can’t seem to get VDL anywhere near this set of effects.  Any suggestions on how to get the combination of effects built into a cake?

[Neil]

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Check out part number PSC123 in the Wizard catalog and part number RA143039 in the Raccoon catalog. Both are similar effects (the Wizard one seems to match the product in question). PSC123 has been customized with the effect editor and RA143039 has not.

 

 

PSC123 from the Wizard catalog:
30mm 24 Shot (a) {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} Cake, 1 Row (-55a48/55a/-47a/47a/-39a/39a/-31a/31a/-23a/23a/-15a/15a/-15a/15a/-23a/23a/-31a/31a/-39a/39a47/-47a/47a/-55a/55a/CAK)

 

RA143039 from the Raccoon catalog:

1.2″ 52 Shot (a) 35.0 HTM Slightly Small Dense Green Mine w/ Slightly Small Very Sparse Gold Glittering Above w/ Slightly Small Very Bright Very Sparse Blue Above Cake, 1 Row (-65a0/65a50/-61a0/61a50/-57a0/57a50/-53a0/53a50/-48a0/48a50/-44a0/44a50/-40a0/40a50/-36a0/36a50/-32a0/32a50/-28a0/28a50/-23a0/23a50/-19a0/19a50/-15a0/15a50/-15a0/15a50/-19a0/19a50/-23a0/23a50/-28a0/28a50/-32a0/32a50/-36a0/36a50/-40a0/40a50/-44a0/44a50/-48a0/48a50/-53a0/53a50/-57a0/57a50/-61a0/61a50/-65a0/65a/CAK)

[Barehm]

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thank you, Neal! That was very helpful. Perhaps this is one of those cakes you can only really build effectively in the Effect editor. Definitely an area of weakness on my part that I’ll have to keep working on.

 

-Brett

[DrewFinale]

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Hi Barehm, doing some custom tuning in the effect editor can make the individual cake shot effect more realistic, but the effect editor absolutely isn’t required (in this case) and the cake as a whole actually can NOT be created or edited in the effect editor. Here’s the VDL for the effect in the Raccoon cake:

 

1.2″ 35m Slightly Small Dense Green Mine w/ Slightly Small Very Sparse Gold Glittering Above w/ Slightly Small Very Bright Very Sparse Blue Above

 

The text that follows in the Raccoon cake VDL (-65a0/65a50/-61a0…) is called the exact simulation syntax. This is generated as a fallback when you arrange individual cake shots on the timeline, select them, and go to ‘Effects > Combine as cake effect’ if the cake combiner can’t match the sequence of shots to one of the standard firing patterns. You can learn more about the exact syntax here: https://finale3d.com/documentation/exact-simulation-syntax/

[Barehm]

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Just in case it’s useful to anyone else looking at this cake, the sweeps on it go inside to outside, back to inside. Flipping the order of angles in the exact sim syntax gets you this:

 

1.2″ 24 Shot (a) {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} Cake, 1 Row (-15a48/15a/-15a/15a/-23a/23a/-31a/31a/-39a/39a47/-47a/47a/-55a/55a/-55a/55a/-47a/47a/-39a/39a/-31a/31a/-23a/23a/CAK)

[Curtis B]

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Barehm

 

I tried getting it without ANY “exact syntax” and this is the best I could do…

 

1.2″ 72 Shot Cake (a) 1.8 DUR 35 HTM Small Very Bright Very Sparse Very Sparse Sparse Very Long Blue Mine Above + (b) 1.2 DUR 10 HTM Slightly Big Very Dense Green Strobing Mine + (c) 0.8 DUR 25 HTM Small Very Sparse Very Sparse Sparse Short Orange Strobing Willow Mine, 1 Row (-15a0/b/c/15a/b/c45/-25a0/b/c/25a/b/c60/-35a0/b/c/35a/b/c60/-45a0/b/c/45a/b/c60/-55a0/b/c/55a/b/c60/-65a0/b/c/65a/b/c289/-65a0/b/c/65a/b/c60/-55a0/b/c/55a/b/c60/-45a0/b/c/45a/b/c60/-35a0/b/c/35a/b/c60/-25a0/b/c/25a/b/c60/-15a0/b/c/15a/b/c/CAK)

 

As you see, even then some of it is Exact Syntax. This is one of those “cakes” where you pretty much just need to use the effects editor to make.

[DrewFinale]

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Hi Barehm and Curtis B, I think there may be a little confusion on terminology or about the function of the “effect editor” versus the “exact syntax”. These are independent aspects of VDL. The effect editor allows you to customize the visual appearance of individual effect simulations. This result in effects being represented by stings of text inside curly braces { }. Separately, the exact syntax is used to specify the firing pattern and timing of a cake when it can’t be represented by one of the standard firing patterns.

 

Here’s an example of a cake that contains a custom effect and uses exact syntax. The custom effect is highlighted in bold.

 

1.2″ 24 Shot (a) {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} Cake, 1 Row (-15a48/15a/-15a/15a/-23a/23a/-31a/31a/-39a/39a47/-47a/47a/-55a/55a/-55a/55a/-47a/47a/-39a/39a/-31a/31a/-23a/23a/CAK)

 

 

Here’s an example of a cake that doesn’t contain a custom simulation and uses the exact syntax. The exact syntax portion is highlighted in bold.

 

1.2″ 72 Shot Cake (a) 1.8 DUR 35 HTM Small Very Bright Very Sparse Very Sparse Sparse Very Long Blue Mine Above + (b) 1.2 DUR 10 HTM Slightly Big Very Dense Green Strobing Mine + (c) 0.8 DUR 25 HTM Small Very Sparse Very Sparse Sparse Short Orange Strobing Willow Mine, 1 Row (-15a0/b/c/15a/b/c45/-25a0/b/c/25a/b/c60/-35a0/b/c/35a/b/c60/-45a0/b/c/45a/b/c60/-55a0/b/c/55a/b/c60/-65a0/b/c/65a/b/c289/-65a0/b/c/65a/b/c60/-55a0/b/c/55a/b/c60/-45a0/b/c/45a/b/c60/-35a0/b/c/35a/b/c60/-25a0/b/c/25a/b/c60/-15a0/b/c/15a/b/c/CAK)

[Curtis B]

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DrewFinale is there a way to turn the VDL I created into a “normal” VDL or due to the nature of the effect and having to create a cake effect from multiple cake effects makes it impossible to NOT use exact syntax?

[Barehm]

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I think I caused some initial confusion as I posted by ‘inverted’ VDL before I saw you post (that’s what I get for posting before refreshing the page). You answer was clear.  The part I was missing was that you could build this type of mine using the ‘above’ VDL keyword instead of adding new nodes in the effect editor. Short of some tweaking, I don’t see a big reason to use the effect editor here (or in general).  Rarely so I need to change the details at that level.

 

I build most of my cakes by making individual effects and combining them into a cake. I don’t especially care the resulting syntax because I just break it apart when I want to change something.

 

The Glossary of VDL terms is great to have this year – thanks for finishing that up. I got excited when you showed me the work in progress at PGI.  Huge help!

 

-Brett

[DrewFinale]

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Hey Curtis B, if your cake can be represented by one of the standard Firing patterns for cake and slice rows, then yes, it can absolutely be converted. You mentioned create a cake from cakes, this caught my eye. Creating a cake by combining other cakes can give you bad results. I don’t recommend it and I can’t think of a reason it should be necessary.

 

It should always be possible arrange the individual shots for a cake on the timeline and then do ‘Combine as cake…’. If the cake combiner can’t match the firing pattern on the timeline to one of the standard firing patterns, it will fall back to the exact syntax. In most cases, the cake combiner should give you ideal VDL. In rare cases, you might be able to do better by handwriting the VDL.

 

To try and convert your cake to use a standard firing pattern, I would break it apart into single shots, then try recombining it. If the cake combiner can figure out how to represent the cake without the exact syntax, then the only option is to hand write the VDL.

[Curtis B]

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DrewFinale the main reason I created a cake from several “cakes” for this effect was due to the nature of how the term “Above” was working. It didn’t seem like it wanted to the gold glittering above the green strobe no matter how I tried. I wound up utilizing the “HTM” term for each part of the effect and then combined those effects as a cake. I then spread those “cakes” on a timeline and specified their degrees because the specific effect has a blank space from about -10° to 10° when you look at the actual video.

 

I think the only way to make this cake properly is to use Exact Syntax (not effects editor) as due to the blank space in the middle. Maybe I’m missing something but I don’t think you could create 2 “fans” that fire at the same time using the cake descriptors of FNL/FNR.

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