Nov 2023 Cakes Contest // Official Topic & FAQ
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DrewFinaleJoined: Dec 2019 Posts: 468 Location: United States 
SilverWelcome to the official FAQ and discussion topic for the November 2023 Cake Design Contest. For full contest details, visit
finale3d.com/contests/cakecontest2023Don’t wait to get started, the deadline to submit your contest entry is November 30, 2023. Have a question? Post it here!
November 2023 Cake Contest FAQ:
Do I need a Finale 3D license to enter the contest?
To enter the contest, you need to create and submit the full VDL description for 10 cakes simulations. Technically, you can create effects without a license, but it would be more difficult because you cannot save your progress if you close Finale 3D.
What version of Finale 3D do I need to enter the contest?
Any version of Finale 3D (Lite, Hobbyist or Pro) can be used to enter the contest.
Pyro_37110000Joined: Aug 2020 Posts: 5 Location: Cincinnati, Ohio, United States 
NewcomerDrewFinaleJoined: Dec 2019 Posts: 468 Location: United States SilverHi Pyro_37110000, great question. The primary goal of the contest is to hire designers to help make improvements to the built-in supplier catalogs. We limited the contest to VDL because we plan to make the catalog improvements primarily with VDL. Using VDL allows effects to be created and edited more quickly, and it will allow users who are pulling effects from the catalogs to make basic edits much more quickly in the future. Limiting the contest and catalog improvements to VDL will also force us to continue improving the capabilities of VDL itself.
The undisputable advantage of the effect editor is the ability control almost every simulation parameter of an effect. This makes it possible to create extremely realistic simulations. The downside is that once an effect has been customized in the effect editor, the only way to further edit the effect is in the editor. For example, suppose that you create a 3″ Red Peony. Then, in the future you need to change the prefire time, duration, or height. If the effect is represented by VDL, you can simply enter a new value directly in the Effects window. But, if the effect has been customized in the effect editor, changes made in the Effects window will not change the simulation whatsoever. Bottom line – once a custom effect, always a custom effect, and you have to go back into the effect editor to make any future changes. In this way, custom effects are somewhat harder to edit. Cakes also can’t be edited directly in the effect editor. Yes, you can make individual custom effects, and use those effects to create a cake. But to edit a custom effect used in a cake, first you have to break apart the cake, then edit the individual effects, then put the cake back together. Bottom line, the effect editor is awesome, we just decided it wasn’t the best approach for this project.
Pyro_37110000Joined: Aug 2020 Posts: 5 Location: Cincinnati, Ohio, United States Newcomer
screaming_vegetablesJoined: Jun 2022 Posts: 1 Location: Oviedo, Florida, United States NewcomerDrewFinaleJoined: Dec 2019 Posts: 468 Location: United States SilverHi screaming_vegetables, great question. It’s not a typo, “Ta Dah!” is actually 36 shots with some tubes containing both a standard comet and a crossette comet. The challenge really is isn’t fair though because it’s not currently possible to replicate the effect accurately using only VDL. Visually, the best workaround would be to add more shots, but I’d prefer to have the shot count be accurate and instead pretend the two effects are one. For example, treat the effect as if it were a crossette comet that starts with a tail and then transitions after the crossette split. VDL does support color changing crossettes.
Phil (Fire In the Sky Pyrotechnics)Joined: Aug 2022 Posts: 12 Location: Kissimmee, Florida NewcomerGood Day,
A simple question. I know it is not part of the entry form but wouldn’t our simulations of the cakes be a desirable thing? I understand you can create the simulations from the submitted VDL, but having it already on a .fin file might speed your judging process.
DrewFinaleJoined: Dec 2019 Posts: 468 Location: United States SilverHi Phil (Fire In the Sky Pyrotechnics), thanks for the thoughtful question. We considered having contestants submit FIN files, but we decided that simply having VDL submitted was a better approach for this contest. On the judging side, it actually only takes a few seconds to bring the VDL for an entire batch of cakes back into Finale 3D.
The challenge with FIN files is that they can’t be uploaded directly to the contest entry form. This is a limitation we hope to eliminate in the future. In the meantime, it means that contestants have to go somewhere else to upload their file and then provide a link. For small files, email is an option, but that can lead to confusion when we are trying to match the emails up with form submissions. On balance, we decided it was just simpler to have a one and done way to enter this contest.
Pyro_269620000Joined: Jul 2023 Posts: 2 Location: Olathe, Kansas, United States NewcomerDrewFinaleJoined: Dec 2019 Posts: 468 Location: United States SilverGood Morning!
Are we allowed to combine effects to make the cake? The VDL does get lengthy. Thanks, C
Sorry, I’m not sure what you mean by ‘combine effects’, can you give me an example?
Pyro_269620000Joined: Jul 2023 Posts: 2 Location: Olathe, Kansas, United States NewcomerDrewFinaleJoined: Dec 2019 Posts: 468 Location: United States SilverFor example, if you were creating the effects individually to get the desired look, timing, etc. Then highlight/select them all to “combine as cake effect.” under the effects tab. Is that allowed? Thanks
Yes, in fact, the completed full VDL for each cake is what you need to submit for the contest. VDL for individual effects from within cakes (i.e. individual cake shots) can’t be submitted.
Phil (Fire In the Sky Pyrotechnics)Joined: Aug 2022 Posts: 12 Location: Kissimmee, Florida NewcomerI have looked over the latest VDL documentation and I still cannot find a descriptive term that tells the VDL to delay the second defined effect. VDL like red peony to crackle flower, fires the crackle flower much too soon to accurately depict some the cake effects.
NeilJoined: Aug 2022 Posts: 15 Location: Southern Iowa NewcomerHey there, Phil! I think your question touches on exactly what the contest is about — 😀 to see how different people handle creating sims for the various effects using the VDL system, knowing that the effects won’t always be completely accurate, that VDL is limited, and that peoples’ knowledge and experience with the system varies wildly, to see what methods and syntax people use to create the most accurate and useful sims.
To get the delayed effect you’re describing, you could try experimenting with the VDL effect adjustment terms related to duration, like “long”, etc. For example, “Long Red Peony to Crackling Flowers” will delay the crackling flowers part of the effect.
For single effects, you can also specify exact duration of the stars in seconds by just adding that to the VDL description. For example, “4s Red Peony to Crackling Flowers” will give you ~4 seconds of the “Red Peony” part of the effect before transitioning to the “Crackling Flowers” part. Keep in mind that if you want to specify an exact duration like this for an effect within a cake VDL (rather than a single shot effect), you will need to include the term “DUR” to specify your duration for that effect (like “4s DUR Red Peony to Crackling Flowers”). Otherwise, if you just include “4s” alone, Finale will see that as the overall cake duration. See more about this on the VDL timing adjustment terms page.
DrewFinaleJoined: Dec 2019 Posts: 468 Location: United States SilverHey there, Phil! I think your question touches on exactly what the contest is about — 😀 to see how different people handle creating sims for the various effects using the VDL system, knowing that the effects won’t always be completely accurate, that VDL is limited, and that peoples’ knowledge and experience with the system varies wildly, to see what methods and syntax people use to create the most accurate and useful sims.
Very well said, Neil. One of the current limitations in VDL is that your can’t independently specify the durations of different parts of a transitioning effect. An example would be ‘Red To Blue Peony’. While you can specify the overall duration of the stars, you can’t specific the duration of the red phase and independently from the blue phase. Of course, this can be done in the effect editor, but that’s not allowed in this contest.
Neil’s suggestions to use VDL adjustment terms such as, ‘Long’, ‘Short’, etc. as in, ‘Long Red to Blue Peony’, or to specify the overall effect duration in seconds, as in ‘3s Red to Blue Peony’, are spot on.
One clarification about specifying durations in seconds vs. using ‘DUR’ – it’s true that ‘DUR’ needs to be used for effects within a cake. But, if you are creating effects for a cake as single shots, then using ‘Effects > Combine as cake’ to write the full cake VDL for you, then you don’t need to worry about using ‘DUR’ in your single shots. For example, a single shot with the VDL ‘3s Red To Blue Peony’ will automatically be translated to ‘3 DUR Red To Blue Peony’ when combined into a cake.
Curtis BJoined: Jan 2023 Posts: 25 Location: Ozark, Missouri, United States NewcomerNot for any cake in particular, but is there a way to notate a break being more of a “canister” versus a “ball shell” by chance? I’m looking at the spread on some of these effects and it doesn’t seem like I can really get the break to do what I want due to the VDL software to imagine things as ball shells versus canister shells? Maybe I’m missing something here though?
DrewFinaleJoined: Dec 2019 Posts: 468 Location: United States SilverHi Curtis B, try using the VDL term ‘Ragged’ to make a break pattern less spherical. Conversely, you can use ‘Uniform’ to make a break pattern more spherical. See VDL effect adjustment terms.
Curtis BJoined: Jan 2023 Posts: 25 Location: Ozark, Missouri, United States NewcomerHi Curtis B, try using the VDL term ‘Ragged’ to make a break pattern less spherical. Conversely, you can use ‘Uniform’ to make a break pattern more spherical. See VDL effect adjustment terms.
Yeah, I’ve used both in the VDL but it doesn’t make the stars “spit” out of the shell vs “burst” out of the shell… its a horsetail effect BUT a VERY sloppy horsetail that I am shooting for. I may be trying to get too precise too, lol
DrewFinaleJoined: Dec 2019 Posts: 468 Location: United States SilverHi Curtis B, for an aerial break pattern in which the stars are ejected from one end of a tube, try the VDL term ‘Ear’.
Curtis BJoined: Jan 2023 Posts: 25 Location: Ozark, Missouri, United States NewcomerIf we have language like this { (30a86/15a81/0a76/-15a96/-30a6678/-20b100/0b/20b4469/30c100/15c/0c/-15c/-30c4759/-20d100/0d/20d4945/30e100/15e/0e/-15e/-30e5052/-20f100/0f/20f/CAK) } at the end of our VDL, will we be disqualified?
This is from combining things on a timeline and then using the “Combine as Cake Effect”. Just making sure so I don’t put a lot of work into making realistic sims and it all be for not.
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